Buying and selling in online

Everyday Islamic Finance Business and Career Questions
#1

Assalamu alaikum

I have an online shop of dress. Some days before I heard that online shopping is ok only if its all details are provided. Now for this shop I upload the product images. Now sometimes it is not possible to show very much details image because -

  1. it takes too much time to unroll a saree and then take its picture
  2. and it is also very difficult so roll the cloth back to their proper shape. (this is the main reason actually)
  3. it takes too much time for one product if I do so.

having said that I will also like to add that, I try to show the details my best, if it is easier. And never ever hide any defect of the product knowingly.

So will it be ok?
I mean when client asks me what will be the color its blouse I tell them it will be x color or y color. I am not sure 100%. And they also have no issue with that. As such cases are very common in our counry. Even sometimes physical shopkeepers don’t unroll the full product due to its rolling system.
Is it ok?

And another issue is when I buy from whole sellers, as they have much more working rush they sometimes (most of the time actually) can not show a detailed image. They write the details like its material, length etc. But not details image is provided. Like most of the time only the rolled image of the cloth is provided. So you don’t know what will be the color of its pallu or how exactly will its design be or what will be the blouse color be. But you can assume the color (70% your assumption will be correct). Now I have no problem buying in such cases. In fact sometimes I asked for details image. But they can’t provide (may be they don’t want or they don’t have time). I have no issue if I have to buy from them in such a way (as almost everyone is buying from them in this way, and practically if I always knock tthem for detailed images then they will actually loss their interest in selling products to me or give me the details after answering everyone else. `As they have a looooooot of customers. And I will ultimately fail to buy the product that I liked!!!) Will it be ok if I buy cloth in such way that the color, image of design details is not provided.

#2

Wasalam

May Allah bless you.

  • For online shopping, one must provide as much information as possible. Even there is no pictures, one must provide details of the colour, designs and length of the pallu for example.

  • For physical shopping, the seller must provide these details too.

I know there are some shopkeepers who would be annoyed if they had to unroll the saree fully, whilst some would be happy to do so. Lot of them have display it on mannequins too.

I personally do not agree with the method of selling something without disclosing the full details of the item. I do not feel the various method mentioned in your question are shariah compliant. These sort of methods can lead to deception and disagreement between the buyer and seller.

The seller must take every reasonable step to disclose as much information as possible. He shouldn’t sell something which he himself has no knowledge of.

Although, I appreciate that sometimes some items,cannot be fully put on display. because of the risk of being damaged. The solution would be to provide with all necessary information about the item, and where possible, to offer a refund in the case where the customer is not happy with the purchase.

@Mufti_Faraz_Adam may have an opinion of his own in this matter.

And Allah knows best!

#3

Thanks for your reply. But please let me add one thing

the wholesalers do not usually have their product shown on mannequins.I mean I have only found one such wholesaler, I promise. That also because they are retailer too. As wholesalers are really very much busy!!! :frowning: I REALLY did not find any other people like him who drapes their product on mannequin.

but some people do like below

  1. if they have 10 sarees/ kamizes of same type (if not 100% same to same design, then similar.) with different color. Then they provide one open image of 1 product with the details. (and if some queries are asked to them which are not available in the image they reply the query. Like what is the color of its blouse and they reply color is “x”) And after that they give images of the other saress/kamizes in a brief and If you ask for detailed image they will say that “these sarees have same design like that saree.Same design. But color is different” And they mention the color. and in my main question by the word “design” I meant the print/ embroidery of the saree/kamiz.I should have asked more preciously. Pardon me

  1. And one more question if the buyer and seller have no problem with such type of selling where some details are not disclosed. Then, even in that case it does not comply with sharia?

  2. I have already bought many cloth in this way and sold also. As it has become so common in the world of cloth at least in countries like india, bangladesh. So people usually don’t complain about these details which are not disclosed actually (assumed)!!!

  3. My main concern is even if I manage to show products to my customers showing all the details from next time, I REALLY FEAR that I will not be able to buy in such a way from the wholesalers. Nobody will give me that much time to provide very much detailed image. :frowning:

  4. And one more thing, (I promise I am not saying this to have your answer on my favour),As a buyer when I don’t get details image of products or details caption(I mean I can’t have a view of the design by image or caption) in such case I have only ONE criteria for the design to be fulfilled (that is the design can have ANYTHING it it other than any animal figure). And I make it sure by asking the supplier (at least I give my 100% to figure out) if the cloth design/ embroidery fulfils my criteria or not. Will it be ok?

  5. (this question is related to number 5 actually) there are some products whose design motifs are similar from a very long time. Like kashmiri shawl. You will see that almost all kashmiri shawl has floral works of similar type in it. Again some sarees are known to have similar (not same) type of design in its body and pallu. Which are known case. So in this case is it ok if only the body image or pallu image is provided (I am asking this question as a buyer. As wholesaler does not provide a long details about the product design. They provide material details and length details. But 100% design details is not actually given to be very honest. And please consider the matter that the design patterns in body and pallu for this type of sarees are known to everyone. I mean after seeing such a saree/shawl one can easily that it is kashmiri prodcut/ it is monipuri product. And what will be the case if I sell the with out giving each and every details about it? As usually all the ladies of our country can assume how the blouse portion may be.And how the embroidery/ print of it may be.That is there will be some random floral design, random designs of different shapes. And usually they have no complain, queries about detailed design specially when it comes to this special category of saree/kamiz/shawl like kashmiri shawl, Monipuri saree.Their main concern for this type saree is the color combination not design. Which I try to declare very accurately.

  6. and as for specifying cloth color I try to be very much specific about it. But as there are hundreds of shades of a single color (even black has 20-30 shades) I try keep my details as accurate as possible but also put the closure that the color shade may vary 5-10% as the resolution of phone/pc devices are DIFFERENT from man to man. (This case is also known to almost every online buyer who buy cloth from online that the color may vary 5-10%. Very much known issue at least in India, Bangladesh)
    Please reply

#4

  1. In the first scenario you have mentioned, yes there is no problem with it. As longer as they provide the necessary information. They don’t have to display all the colours, as longer you know which colour clothing you are getting from them. Same with the pattern on the saree or salwar kameez, sometimes some pattern are quite similar but not exactly the same. That can be tolerated. However, if the design are too different then it is problematic. For example, if you think you are getting a saree which is heavily embroidered and they sell you something which is barely embroidered, then it is not acceptable.

  2. Yes if the most important information in a product are hidden, then selling it would not be permissible even if the customer is happy. In the time of the prophet (pbuh) there were certain transaction which was widely practised among people, yet the prophet (pbuh) prohibited them as they were not based on justice.

  3. This is a bad habit that must not be tolerated.

  4. Try negotiating with them. You are the customer so you have a bargaining power too. Otherwise look for different wholesalers as soon as possible. Once you find a more honest one, then switch over to them.

  5. I mean you need to ask about the main characteristic of the cloths. You need to find out things like: is there an animal figure, what is the colour and size, type of material i.e. cotton, silk etc, type of pattern i.e. is it all over the kameez for example, has it got stones in it etc. Is it patiala or churidar etc.

  6. Yes I agree, where certain type of cloths are more or less similar and people are usually aware of what it will look like or don’t pay much attention to it. As you mentioned, certain type of shawl may have certain random patterns that people don’t really care about. This is fine in this scenario. This happens a lot when the aim of the people is to get certain type of clothing for a specific purpose, without paying much attention to the odd designs. What matters to them might be the colour and size, for example, men’s pants for jubbas. Some of them may/may not have patterns on the cuffs, which is not a matter of concern for the customers.

  7. Yes as longer it is specified then it is fine.

And Allah knows best!

1 Like
#5

Many thanks for your reply. May Allah bless you. So I will mainly try to purchase products from wholesaler as per situation number 1, that I stated.

And as for number 5 main main issues are found out by asking question. But most of them said it is not possible to send me each and every detailed image. Like they will provide me some demo image and say your one will also have similar design (print/embroidery). From similar I meant if the demo image have heavy work in it then my product will also be so.But it will happen that the demo image have a design of diamond shape and I got design of triangle shape/floral shape.But the cloth material, length, softness all are same. Hope it is ok too?

and for number 6-> people actually don’t even ask for some details (like what does the design of the blouse look like, what does the design like pallu look like.) They do so either they don’t care much about it or they can overlook the design they just concern about the color.So for such type of cloth it is also ok to not providing thaaaaaaaaat much detailed image? Right?

  1. And for the color specification I REALLY try to provide the real color name (some times I try even by searching witth hash code of color in google and then find out the color name).But 100% time it is not possible to find out the name of the shade!! Like blue has around 50-60 shades of it. I try to mark the closest color/colors from the available color palate from google. But always being 100% accurate to specifying in color shade is not possible. (i believe everybody faces this same situation). In such case will it be problematic? I am only indicating to color shades not the other descriptions like material, length etc. Last situation is ONLY for color shades.
    And 99% wholesaler never write the shades details along with the product.But if their own photo is not near to the real color (like dark navy blue and black these two color is very tough to distinguish sometimes) then they declare the color that, this is black this is navy blue. Other wise color details is not added thoroughly like (this is cyan blue/ this is teal blue/this is light orange etc). So as a buyer I (any reseller) have to buy in this way.I mean one has to keep this veryyyyyy color shade details aside if one wants to buy online :confused: If this tiny details of color shade is also needed when I buy then I do not know how to continue my business!!! As my sellers are from India and I am from Bangladesh I can not go to them physically and purchase from them.

WhatsApp Image 2020-05-31 at 2.47.12 PM
WhatsApp Image 2020-05-31 at 2.47.12 PM780Ă—1040 113 KB

In the image I am just giving you an example that I made to make my question clear. In image you can see a lot of sarees. Whose demo picture was shared with me with material details and length price.And all these sarees will be similar to that saree which was shared to me.Like if that saree has plain pallu all these sarees will be of plain pallu.If that saree has stripe in pallu all these saree will also have stripes in pallu (color different. And usually the stripes color is not disclosed and they are not very much important too. body color is main issue here.). So now you can see they have not declared any color name along with the images. Let, when the took image only one saree’s color was not matching in image. So they declare the color of that one only. And we all know that color may vary a bit due to photography. Is it ok? Almost every wholesaler of india sells in such way.Even if I try I don’t know if I can found any other way or not :frowning:
( I edited the image to give this example.).
And as already I have sold 1 cloth in the way which you found out to be wrong (that is each and every details was not provided.) do I need to throw those money too? And I have bought in the same way from the wholesaler where each and everyyyyyy details was specified. Though when I sold them I tried to describe the details properly. Can I sell those cloth? As there is a lot of cloth if I can’t not sell them I will be fall in problem.

Sorry for bothering you again and again. Actually I am very nervous and confused!!! Please don’t get angry.

#6

@Mufti_Billal sahab, I am in need of your answer :frowning:

#7

  1. Yes it is fine as longer you also mention to the customer that some patter may vary.

  2. No you can’t make that into a general rule. A person might be led to deception because of the image they see. For example, I bought a piece of fabric recently on Amazon, I did not ask any questions because I relied on the advertised image. When it got delivered, it was totally different. Neither there was a mentioned of it being different to the image.This is wrong and unacceptable.

For something minor which is widely known among people and which is not a matter of concern to the general public, then an exception can be made. For example, toilet tissue ,people don’t care if there is pattern or not because the pattern has got no purpose. Cheap Cashmere shawl, which people use only to protect themselves from the cold. The design in them serves not purpose i.e. people are not buying it to look nice. Some clothing are known to be worn at home privately (i.e. not in front of the general public), these clothing, people don’t care much about designs or not, because they have no purpose. Cheap table cloth of bad quality, people buy them to cover the table to eat messy food or to put on the floor for work. The designs in them have no purpose.

On the other hand, let’s say a wedding saree for example, do you think someone will not care about every detail of the dress? Or an expensive table cloth that people will only use when they have guests at home etc. In these sort of items, it is important to display the important characteristics.

  1. Yes that way it is fine. Shades in images will differ to what it looks like in real life. The difference can be tolerated. When you sell it, you can just mention that the shades might be different to the image.

You do not need to give away the money you have made so far. You can sell the cloths which you have already bought. Just be conscious next time.

And Allah knows best!

1 Like
#8

I really really appreciate such a elaborate reply from he bottom of my heart. May Allah bless you.

And regarding number 6-> I actually meant that, usually people don’t care about some details of some products.Because either the embroidery style of that product is similar with one another and people know it or they can overlook that details. Suppose I need to buy a panjabi from “x” shop.I know the pattern of their produced panjabi. I only concern about the color of the panjabi and whether they have some embroidery in neck or not.Now, I don’t bother about the detailed design of the embroidery, or the thread color of the embroidery. I just care if the embroidery is heavy or little.So in this case, I only need to check the issues that I bother for right (apart from the main character of a panjabi that is its length, size, material)? The other details about whom I don’t care about for this particular panjabi I don’t need to ask. Right? (And my English may have many grammatical errors Please pardon me)

#9

Yes that is right.

But as a seller, you cannot always assume that the person will not care about the information which you are holding away from them.

#10

I really really appreciate such a elaborate reply from he bottom of my heart. May Allah bless you.
I am sorry that, I am failing to clear my point and knock you again and again. Actually I am very confused in nature.
And regarding number 6-> I actually meant that, usually people don’t care about some details of some products.Because either the embroidery style of that product is similar with one another and people know it or they can overlook that details. Suppose I need to buy a panjabi from “x” shop.I know the pattern of their produced panjabi. I only concern about the color of the panjabi and whether they have some embroidery in neck or not.Now, I don’t bother about the detailed design of the embroidery, or the thread color of the embroidery. I just care if the embroidery is heavy or little.So in this case, I only need to check the issues that I bother for right (apart from the main character of a panjabi that is its length, size, material)? The other details about whom I don’t care about for this particular type of panjabi I don’t need to ask. Right? Again some type of sarees have similar stripes in their pallu. That is stripe pattern is almost same but collor different. For example you can take the above image I shared in last comment. Now, suppose the stripes color is not that much significant for me rather the body color and pallu color is important for me. So in such cases I can overlook the details about the stripe color right (when buying) them? Why I am asking it to you again, because today one of the wholesalers told me “will not sell to you. you ask too many question!!!” May be I am getting confused more that necessary!!!

(And my English may have many grammatical errors Please pardon me)

#11

Ok. I will definitely share the details while selling as much as possible. I actually did so.But my main issue was regarding buying.And now it is clear. Thanks a lot.

May Allah blees you and your family

#12

Assalamu alaikum @Mufti_Billal.
I have started to get some confusion (may be it is ocd!) Please check my question if possible

As I mentioned that I sell ladies garments (saree). After your last messages I became more and more cautious while buying from the wholesaler. But now I got 2 confusion in my mind

  1. A saree is usually around 550 cm long. So sometimes this may happen that small thread knots are (which are not that much large) visible in the product. This thread knots are not granted as defects and it is well known that handloom product may have such type of uneven weaving which are ignorable. So wholesaler jus declare that, the product may have some small visible thread knots. Is it ok? I mean if you are buying 100 pieces of cloth from them they will give this message as a declaration that “small thread knots, spot are not granted as defect. your saree may have them”. Is it ok?

  2. Some (actually many) cloths give a dual shade depending on light. Like the product is mainly pink. but it gives an orange dual depending the light reflecting on it. When buying from the wholesaler it is not possible to confirm this much details. That if this saree give dual shade or not depending on light. if yes then which color dual shade it gives. The main color is shown in image, (description) but it’s each and every details (like dual tone/shade) is not possible to get while purchasing them. Is it ok? (Please remember this is a very detailed character and this type of description NO wholesaler provides.)

Though while selling I try to mention the dual color tone/shade depending on light.

#13

Wasalam

May Allah bless you.

  1. Yes it’s acceptable in this situation.

  2. Yes if there is a description of the main colour from the wholesaler then it’s ok. It is the light that causes the dual shade from happening it’s not the clothing in itself. Unless , the cloth has been made with a reflective fabric which might cause be an issue. Reflective fabric is similar to what is on Hi-Viz that shines under the light at night.

#14

Thanks for your reply :slight_smile:

Actually the fabric is not any reflective fabric similar to Hi-Viz. Rather the issue of its dual shade is

  1. the thread it self is silk. which has a shiny characteristic.
  2. Due to using different chemicals (like sodium hydroxide) while preparing the thread it self becomes more shiny. That is why it gives dual shades depending on light.
  3. The cloth is prepared with threads of different hue of same color. Like some thread is of light blue, some are of ajure, cyan etc, And as a result, the basic color of the product is blue. But it also gives some shades of different hue/ tone of color blue.

So, it is ok, if one does not dig in for this much of detailed information while buying?

#15

Ok. So when I post a product details for selling I add in the description something like-> it is common that some small spot, thread knots may be visible in the saree. This is not a defect. ok? @Mufti_Billal

#16

please answer @Mufti_Billal :frowning:

#17

Wasalam

Yes, this is fine.

And Allah knows best!